A brooch

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Incognito
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A brooch

Post by Incognito » Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:27 pm

Gasket, another gasket, a ring! No, the trim off a screwtop bottle cap. Very few ring-like objects turn out to be more than, well, ring-like objects. So here is a gasket, or drawer handle, or loop, that wasn't.

First impression was something to do with tractor engines, maybe from a saddle, oh well. I rarely clean anything but this ring just told me how I'd forgotten to and made me feel neglectful, so let's bring it back to this world why not. After scraping off some encrusted soil the first thing of note was a small sawn notch, must be to fit it to place I suppose. Polishing off the (not particularly nice on this one) patina and the profile appears, then that the metal has been handworked (by the form of how it is folded and marked), and finally the wear of where the pin rotated. So it is an annular brooch. I leave the patina on the inside to help identify it's age at some point, and go to look up this kind of brooch.


The PAS places this kind of section as maybe late medieval, brooches being notoriously difficult to date sometimes, but apart from Quoit brooches and pseudo penannular brooches there are none where there is a notch for the pin to change side. On web image search neither. The notch does go evenly through from one side to the other, it is just the way the photo is taken that makes it look closed underneath.


So presenting a slightly unique annular brooch which must somewhere have contemporaries. Now to try to find the pin.


Found on the continent, rural area. Finds at site go from pre-roman to modern. Using high frequency detector. Material brass/bronze. Weight 4.5 gr.
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Last edited by Incognito on Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Ladybird66
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Re: A brooch

Post by Ladybird66 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:36 pm

Very nice, well found and cleaned.

How many others have you missed ? :D

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Re: A brooch

Post by Incognito » Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:38 pm

Ladybird66 wrote:
Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:36 pm
Very nice, well found and cleaned.

How many others have you missed ? :D
Thank you.

I only missed one other one at that site, I figured it would be good to leave something for a rainy day ;) .

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Re: A brooch

Post by Ladybird66 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:55 am

:D 😉

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fred
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Re: A brooch

Post by fred » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:06 am

I agree that it is handmade and has some age to it. The slot doesn't really look right for an annular brooch though. It isn't at right angles to the circle so the pin would be well off centre and the pin would have to be excessively narrow to fit it. That isn't how annular brooches work.

I would say that this was just an ordinary brass/bronze ring of the sort that turn up all the time that somebody tried to cut. It isn't a common modification so at this distance in time it would be pure speculation to try and guess why they did it. :D
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Re: A brooch

Post by Incognito » Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:26 pm

fred wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:06 am
I agree that it is handmade and has some age to it. The slot doesn't really look right for an annular brooch though. It isn't at right angles to the circle so the pin would be well off centre and the pin would have to be excessively narrow to fit it. That isn't how annular brooches work.

I would say that this was just an ordinary brass/bronze ring of the sort that turn up all the time that somebody tried to cut. It isn't a common modification so at this distance in time it would be pure speculation to try and guess why they did it. :D


Oh I ? Took me five hours to find that you know....

I still think it is a brooch though :

The section is shaped with a near flat inside and then four more sides, in other words it isnt nornal round ring shaped.

The notch is both very nicely formed and angled in two directions, that is to say it points off center as well as being at an angle through the ring. I figure this is so the pin would jump back after being pushed through.

The section which is worn opposite is a half mm or more thinner, I just dont see a saddle loop settling in one place and doing that for example... it could if held in one position. The worn section is opposite the notch.

It has some kind off light ribbing around the outside which I've never seen before.

So I think it is supposed to work a bit like a pseudo pennanular brooch, but with a lighter more flexible pin maybe. I know there aren't any listed like this, and that I want it to be a brooch also, but I honestly think that is what it is ?

The only other item I found right nearby was a mid 18th century coin, so it could even be that recent, but also roman items are found nearby. I'll try to upload some better photos at some point and just leave it open as questionable ...

:D

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Re: A brooch

Post by Incognito » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:11 pm

It works fine on dishcloths, doesn't come off once through the notch, a quarter turn secures it fully.
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Re: A brooch

Post by thefiggis » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:36 pm

Very interesting item and I somehow managed to miss this first time around.

On balance I'd have to agree that the wear isn't compatible with that of a brooch. It appears to be on the inside of the ring and consitent with what we see so often in these indefinable rings we all find. True, the notch throws that notion into some doubt but I just can't see it as a brooch. Sorry.

I still like the idea that these rings formed part of peasants' belts
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Re: A brooch

Post by Incognito » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:13 pm

thefiggis wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:36 pm
Very interesting item and I somehow managed to miss this first time around.

On balance I'd have to agree that the wear isn't compatible with that of a brooch. It appears to be on the inside of the ring and consitent with what we see so often in these indefinable rings we all find. True, the notch throws that notion into some doubt but I just can't see it as a brooch. Sorry.

I still like the idea that these rings formed part of peasants' belts
There's no need to apologise, that can wait till someone finds one with a pin ;). In the meantime there is the idea of what this one might be for anyone to reference, it isn't going to be more or less than what it is no matter what we think. It seems worn around the outside as well as the inside, but that will have to be someone with better tools than I have to figure it out for sure that way.

It's interesting the idea of rings being used on belts, maybe some lords kept their peasants on a leash ?

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